What You Need to Start a Trucking Company

Jared Flinn: You're listening to the Bolt Floats podcast, your number one resource for everything, bolt freight trucking. Tyler Allison: Hey, guys. Welcome back to the Bulk Loads podcast. My name is Tyler, and today I've got Nick Metheny in here with me. Nic Matheney: Nice to see you guys. First time on the podcast. So it's. Tyler Allison: How's it feel? You've made it. Jared Flinn: I've been here for a while, and I'm the last one to be here, so it's nice to be included. Tyler Allison: We strategically pick who's gonna come on these, and you just have. No, I'm just kidding. This week, Jared is actually out doing some family stuff, so Nick is going to join us and do these intro outros with us. Before we actually get into the episode, we're gonna go over a truck feature like we do on every single episode. Today's truck feature is by Scott Tipton with Hambone Express out of Monroe City, Missouri. Scott's been a member since 2020, and he's also an insurance client with us. So, Scott, we just want to thank you for sending this in and trusting us with your insurance and also being a member with us on the board for so long. This is pretty slick, Rick. Tyler Allison: What do you think, Nick? Nic Matheney: I'm a chrome guy myself, so I love the chromevisor and the chrome stacks and everything. It looks a lot like my father in law's truck, actually. Oh, yeah, with the black. And I'm sure he would like to have a hopper behind it as well. Tyler Allison: Yeah, I like the all. I said this in previous episodes, but I like the all, like, black or the all color matched look. I'm a big fan of it. Whenever they color match the trailer to the actual truck. So. Well, guys, if you can send us your pictures of your trucks via social media or podcast at bulk loads.com, send us pictures, and we will feature you on both social media and the podcast. We want to. We want to highlight you guys and what you guys do, but also, I mean, to be selfish, we love seeing the pictures that trucks ourselves. Tyler Allison: So we actually have kind of a wall of pictures with customers and of customers that we kind of hang up and we look at. So we really like those. Um, as far as today's episode, Nick, we have a Tanner batten coming on with bulk Litz permitting. Tanner is going to come on this episode and talk today. I think they're going to really go over a couple different things, with the main target being the difference in authorities, brokerage authority, carrier authority, and then they're going to dive into, actually the. The big you know, thing of double brokering versus co brokering, kind of explain the differences. And also I believe they're going to talk about exemptions like agriculture exempted products and everything. I want you to kind of touch on. Tyler Allison: You posted a forum post not that long ago talking about how to actually go after a broker's bond if for some reason, you know, they fail to pay out on a load. And we found something interesting, if you want to kind of talk about that. Nic Matheney: Yeah, it surprised me a lot that the, the ag exempt products are sometimes exempt from being filed on the surety bonds, which in our industry and on our load board. That is a huge thing in my mind. That's a, that's a huge loophole for brokers, honestly. And the double brokering thing. And if you guys have any interest in that kind of stuff, let us know because we like to be the voice of all, all of you carriers, brokers and shippers on the load board. So if there's, if there's things like that where there's loopholes where guys are getting through and guys aren't getting paid for work that's actually being done, please let us know because that's something we could definitely work on helping you guys with. Tyler Allison: I will say the use of the rating system on bulk loads. If you're on bulk loads and you use it, I would definitely take advantage of that rating system. And we ask if ever there's a non payment on the load or you've had bad experience with anybody that being carriership or broker, anybody that you've done business with, you've had a good or bad experience, I would ask that you go to that person's profile and leave a rating to let other people know what they're getting into before actually dealing with that person. So like I said, even if you have a positive experience that lets people know, hey, you know, this is a good guy to work with. And then also same thing if you have a negative experience. We hope nobody does, but we know it's out there and we know it happens to. We won't get too much into it. So without further ado, we'll let Tanner go ahead and talk about bulk loads per meeting. Jared Flinn: Tanner, welcome back on I'm back. Tanner Batten : Third time's the charm. And yeah, asking me to come back's always a good sign in my book. Jared Flinn: Well, you are our favorite in house. Tanner Batten : Speaker for the, for permitting. And it doesn't matter that I'm the only one as well. We'll look past that. Jared Flinn: Well, if you don't know Tanner batten, he came on. Tanner Batten : You've been since last year. Jared Flinn: Since last year. Really started and headed up our permitting business, and which has been really cool to see this thing blossom, but more importantly, like, it's really helped us as an organization be more well rounded. I think for me, there was just so much I probably. Well, so much I didn't know about compliance and so much I probably didn't want to know. Like, there was just stuff that, like, when you. I'll say this, you have a gift to dive in and find out, you know, legal legalities, regulations, and all that. And I just. It's not my gift whatsoever. Jared Flinn: So, man, it's been really cool. I want you to tell the audience, and, I mean, we have a really good show, and I want you to stay glued to this one. But what has been really surprising on the permitting business, but more importantly, what you're finding out in the industry, maybe about our customers or maybe things people are doing well or not doing well when it comes to being compliant. Tanner Batten : Yeah. Well, first of all, I will say definitely learning more each and every day, so I don't pretend to know it all. And a lot of it may be, I don't know right now, but I can find out. And so that's hopefully the legwork Jared's talking about of, hey, let me call the FMCSA. Let me call your states. Dot find out from the source, you know? And that's. That's how I learn. And it's been a good opportunity to learn, I think. Tanner Batten : A couple surprises, you know, we're gonna talk about later today, you know, a little more on the brokerage side. There's been a lot of interest in starting a brokerage authority, and obviously, that's where we're gonna spend a lot of time today, you know, but when you look at common mistakes or misconceptions, I think a lot of it comes back to a couple things, especially in our world. Number one being maybe exempt commodities. So running exempt without an MC number. And what truly is exempt, you know, I think there's a lot of things out there that are processed, even in a small way. Almond holes, some kind of feed that is not considered exempt by the FMCSA. And so I think that's a pretty common misconception of, like, it needs to be unprocessed, right. Grain, beans. Tanner Batten : And so there could be a lot of people that even their MC number, their dot number is not set the right way, and maybe they're hauling feed or fertilizer, and those are not exempt. So I think that's a big learning I've had and something hopefully walking guys through. And another thing would be on plates. I know, again, a lot of guys we have run their own product, so maybe they have farm tags. That's another thing that, you know, you're really not supposed to haul for hire with farm tags. That's supposed to be your own product. And obviously, when you compare it to apportioned plates, farm tags are way cheaper. There may be some nuance, some loopholes, things like that. Tanner Batten : But I think that's another misconception, is that I have a farm, I have some own product, I can just run these farm tags for hire and run other people's stuff. And really you shouldn't. And if you get caught on that, you know, you could get hit with a fine. So I think those are a couple of things that really relate to our, um, you know, our guys that we talk to every day in the bulk space, um, and things you really want to make sure you got buttoned up, set up the right way so that if you do get stopped, rolled through a scale, got everything you need in line. Jared Flinn: Talk about on the, the exempt versus non exempt. I guess in my mind, I think that we'll just count it that it's non exempt. That way you're licensed even though you're holding exempt, though, why would someone worry or want to be? I mean, why would they care that it's exempt? Tanner Batten : Yeah, I think, you know, it, it can kind of go in with some eld's stuff as well, of if you're hauling exempt commodities and you're only going outside of your 150 miles radius so many times that you, you know, it can make you exempt also from an eld. Got it. But to your point, that's really how I frame it, is if your set is exempt, you may save some money in FMCSA fees in filing your insurance. You may not be required to have as much. But if a load of fertilizer comes along, if a load of DDG comes along, something that's not exempt and you can't haul it, it could take three to four weeks to get that up and running. So I usually explain to guys, unless they know they're only going to be doing exempt, that it's usually worthwhile. Get your MC number. You can mark both for hire and exempt if you really want to, but that way you can haul any and everything for hire. Tanner Batten : And I think for most guys that makes the most sense. Jared Flinn: I guess, in my mind, I would think that most carriers are going to be doing exempt and non exempt. I mean, they're going to be hauling everything out there. But I guess in your situation there's maybe some of these haulers that really are going to be focused on exempt commodities. Tanner Batten : Right. Right. So I. Yeah, so there's, there's some times when it makes sense and there's some guys who, uh, you know, who do that. If you're also doing, you know, mostly intra state work, staying in your home state, you know, it's not something you probably need to worry about as much. But if you're wanting to go over the road for hire, I think it makes sense to go ahead and get that operating authority mc number for hire. And just so that way, if an opportunity comes along you didn't expect, you're not having to wait three or four weeks or decline work because of just some silly paperwork. Jared Flinn: Really what's been in your mind? And again, the six months you've been doing this like the hardest thing to try to figure out when it's, when it comes to compliance and registration and again, all the back end work that I guarantee a lot of our guys do not like maybe have a hard time understanding. Tanner Batten : Yeah, no, I think it's a good question. I think, you know, when you look at it from federal level, FMCSA, you know, even if we don't agree with all the regulations, the ones that are similar across the board, that makes it simple. But when you get on the state level, okay, every state has a different process for applying for apportioned plates, for IFTA. It's a different website, it's a different. Sometimes they're separate, sometimes they're together, sometimes it's by mail, sometimes it's in person. Every state's completely different also in what they require as far as documentation. And so it just gets really confusing in that sense. And obviously at bulk loads, it's such a great blessing to work with people all over the country, but to try to figure out every single state and all those differences is a challenge. Tanner Batten : And I think those are usually the most painstaking process for our carriers is like renewing your plates. It seems simple, but you have to report your mileage, you have to have all your, you know, your updated 22 90 tax. You have to update some forms and things like that. It's never just like type in this pin, pay it, renew it. There's always something. So I think those things that are specific to each state is what can be the most frustrating. Whereas the FMCSA, it's pretty cut and dry of the process. But each state is going to be vastly different. Jared Flinn: Have you had a glimpse or looked into again, this is pretty fresh in our organization, but dealing with dot audits or having carriers that are. Tanner Batten : Yeah, so we, so yes, we've set up a lot of authorities and usually most people can expect a new entrant audit within the first 18 months. Jared Flinn: Okay. Tanner Batten : And so for most of our guys, they're not, they're not there yet. And it kind of depends. Luck of the draw. You know, it's random of when you're gonna get, when you're gonna get audited. But I think it's actually better if it's early on because then, you know, you can make sure you have everything in order. There's not six to twelve months of records and maybe we're kept the wrong way, but I think the longer we go, the more we're going to deal with it. I don't think any of our guys have actually been called on for an audit yet, but it comes up in conversation all the time of, hey, here's the information you need to have. Hey, you need to use a good physical address because that's where the FMCSA is going to come for the audit. Tanner Batten : And just little nuances like that. But it's a big question. Obviously there's some fear or just like I want to make sure I'm good. I want to make sure I don't get hit with a huge fine right out of the gate. And we also have another local contact in town who has dealt a lot with those. And so if ever there's something I'm not sure on, I send them over to him. Jared Flinn: I always think about that audit because I think nine times out of ten they come out to your, to your place, they come out to the visit, they look at your records, all your documents, and they want to make sure that you're compliant and all. Tanner Batten : Yep. Jared Flinn: All aspects. Tanner Batten : Yep. And I, you know, it's better to, you know, make everything available, you know, to be of course, forthcoming with all the information. I know it may seem like it, but they're not out to get you, shut you down, but they want to make sure everything's done the right way. And so, yeah, we talk about it a lot with our new carriers and I do have some info I send over of just, here's some basic record keeping and things you need to keep, you know, your certificate of authority and things like that. Jared Flinn: We're going to move on to the talking about brokerage authority, but I do want to make a quick plug for you, there's been a couple of these carriers now that you've set up from start to finish. And Joe, if you want to throw a couple of those photos up, they shared. And, man, it warms my heart, and most of our audience knows that I love all businesses, but, man, there's a special place in my heart for these small owner operators. Someone that, you know, was out there looking to get started, got registered, became a business, and now he's flourishing. And, you know, I want to have Joe send a couple of those pictures, and we don't have to talk specifically about them, but just really that we got them set up. They're on the load board. We got them set up with factoring. I think one, you've had a couple of them come back for you, and we've done their insurance now or moved their insurance. Jared Flinn: So it's like, man, we really become that one stop shop to help them. And again, it's not really, I mean, I'll say this blatantly. It's not about us just taking it all and, you know, profiting from it, but, man, really helping these guys and having just a one stop shop to get it all done. I know when I look at businesses and doing stuff, man, if I can go to one place and have it all done, I go to Walmart because I can get my groceries and my fishing gear and everything in one spot. But it's just the same thing. It's really making it simple for these owner operators and the drivers and really giving them the platform to succeed. Tanner Batten : Yeah. And to reiterate on that, I mean, a couple of things there. Number one, you know, it seems like just numbers and figures and forms, but when you see, when I've started to see that dot number and the company name on the side of the truck and, hey, Tanner, I just ran my first load. It's like, wow, it comes to life. And now, yeah, we're rooting for those companies and their business because it's more than just truck. It's more than just numbers. Like, it's a business. It's a livelihood for a lot of guys. Tanner Batten : It's a dream. I've been driving. Now I'm going out on my own, and it's exciting. And so we're excited to see where those guys go. And it's just cool to know that even if it's. We played a small part, that we helped them set up their business and see where they're gonna go. Yeah. And then, you know, to the other point of one stop shop, I think our heart is always to, you know, educate, to cut through the noise, because there's a lot out there, there's a lot of marketing and just be a resource and a consultant to our clients. Tanner Batten : Maybe you don't end up doing everything with us, but we want to have the knowledge that we can walk you through everything. You're going to need a to z to be experts in this. So that when people come to us looking for work is usually the first step that they know they can trust us, they know the heart behind it. And when our customers win, you know, that's a huge win for us. And that's the best part of the job. Jared Flinn: I can say this top down. I think one thing that we look at, we really focus on, hey, how do we provide value at the least amount of cost to the carrier, and really how do we give them everything they need and allows us to be a part of it and everyone to win? And it's been a really cool blessing. So, yeah, and if you're out there listening and want to know more about, and we'll put Tanner's information on there, but again, we can help you in all those stages. Maybe you looking to get started, maybe you've got started. But, man, things are kind of rocky or not certain that you're compliant or there's just have some questions that are dot compliant related. Tanner is a resource for that. So don't think anywhere in this cycle, man, we want to jump in and help be a part of that. Tanner Batten : Yep, absolutely. Absolutely. Um, yeah, don't hesitate to reach out, and if I don't know the answer, I can go find it. Jared Flinn: Yeah. Awesome. Hey, guys, Jared Flynn here. Thank you so much for listening to the Bulk Loads podcast. We started this podcast back in 2018, almost seven years ago, to really be a resource for bulk professionals out there. We wanted to be a platform that really is a positive light on our community, but also gives great, valuable content and insights, everything from trucking to logistics, from everything from buying a truck to helping with freight rates. Again, we have tried to put all that into this podcast to give you a very valuable experience for you to listen to and hopefully make you better decisions and grow your business, man. We appreciate you being a listener on this podcast, but if you haven't yet, make sure and hit the subscribe button, the little Bell, and that way you will be subscribed to every podcast that comes out. Jared Flinn: Also, we would be very thankful for you to share this with your network and social media. Thank you again for listening to the Bulk Loads podcast. God bless. Well, let's move on to brokerage authority. This one I think. I'm not. Just call a spade a spade. This might get some flack out there because we know that it's not, this isn't for everyone. Jared Flinn: But one thing we know over the years that to be successful in trucking, you got to look at all different avenues out there. Tanner Batten : Absolutely. Jared Flinn: And a lot of times if you're hauling for, I'll give you just one example and there's many, but maybe you're hauling for a shipping company and you have one or two trucks, but they need five to sustain. Well, you can't go out there immediately right now and buy those five trucks. Well, how can you still handle all of that freight and service that customer? Because just like I said, being a one stop shop, a lot of these shippers, they want truckers and they want companies to be a one stop shop for them. So how can you do that? So today we're going to talk about maybe adding a brokerage authority to your company is a good avenue because that does allow you legally to actually handle those loads. You know, one thing, and there can be misconceptions out there. You know, one thing we've heard, it's been a buzzword over the past couple years is double broker. Double broker, you know, and double broking isn't when two brokers get together, that's not, I mean that's two brokers, that's double. Yeah, but that is actually called co brokering, which is actually legal through the FMCs. Jared Flinn: Say double brokering is actually when a motor carrier takes a load and puts it on another carrier, another authority's truck. That's actually illegal and it's called double brokering. But if you have a brokerage authority, you can actually do that legally. And that's what we're going to talk about today. Tanner Batten : Yes. Yeah. And like Jared said, it is a buzzword, it's a hot topic and it can be a little frustrating. But we want to make sure that our guys are doing things the right way, the legal way. And the way we look at it is it's an opportunity to grow your business. So it's not just, oh, I got to pay the government more money. It's that if this is the relationship business, and just like Jared said, you do a great job for a shipper, you're going to be able to secure a bigger contract with that shipper and do things the legal way, dispatch to your trucks and then also fill those other loads to other carriers. But in a legal way, the right way, and obviously maybe getting ahead of myself a little bit. Tanner Batten : But that's, that's the need that we've seen in the marketplace and why we've set up several brokerage authorities for companies this year. Jared Flinn: So let's just unpack it and talk about kind of start to finish. If that listener out there is saying, hey, I've heard about this, I probably should look into this. How big of a lift is this going to be? How much of a cost, how much time and energy? How do I make sure that I'm doing it right? Let's, let's just peel back the onion and start. Start with step one. Tanner Batten : Yeah, yeah, for sure. Um, yeah, so step one in my mind is going to be creating a separate business entity. And so just if you were starting a trucking company, you know, most, most people opt to do an LLC or a corporation, but it's going to start with a separate business entity and an Ein. Right. We're not trying to hide anything. Right. Usually it's best to have a totally separate entity address could be separate, but it would be okay if it's the same as your trucking company. In most cases that is okay. Jared Flinn: So I think because that was something that was controversial, like if you had a brokerage authority, like it had to have a separate address, then yeah. Tanner Batten : And you know, as you grow your business, that's something, you know, some people just would prefer, hey, everything's totally separate where that address thing comes into mind. And we do not recommend this at all. But if someone's going to start, sometimes people start two trucking companies. And if you run the same address, like number one, it's going to be very obvious. And that could be a big risk for getting insurance canceled or something like that. But when it's a separate entity such as a brokerage, you usually don't run into that. And I've had people do it both ways and both get approved and get their operating authority, surety bond, everything without any issues. So I can always talk through your individual situation and see. Tanner Batten : Um, but that's kind of the first step. Jared Flinn: Okay. Get your business license, get your entity set up. Tanner Batten : Yep. After that we can apply for a totally separate dot NMC number for the brokerage mark you as a broker. Um, and then just like a trucking company, there's going to be kind of a three to four week period of uh, like a waiting period with the FMCSA. And that's the time to get your surety bond and a boc three. Um, so for a trucking company, you need your proof of liability insurance. Uh, for a brokerage authority, you need your surety bond. Um, and that's a $75,000 surety bond. Um, so talk about that real quick. Jared Flinn: I think sometimes here, 75,000 is like, I don't have $75,000. That's not what that means. Tanner Batten : Yep, yep. So basically, you know what, what the surety bond is for is. Uh, and this might be a sensitive subject. We probably have had some carriers go through this process is if I'm a broker, I'm brokering out loads and I fold up, I close my doors or I don't have the money to pay, then those carriers can file against the surety bond to get payment. Now, I'm going to be the first to recognize that it can be a long process. You may have to hire an attorney. It can be difficult to recoup the funds. And I think we both know that $75,000, if that broker is sending out loads to several carriers, it's probably not going to go very far either. Tanner Batten : And so I think we can both agree that something should probably change on that end. But for right now, we got to work with what we have, and that's the minimum requirement, just as $750,000 is the minimum liability insurance requirement for a trucking company. And so, surety Bond, like Jared said, it's not 75k up front. Most new ventures I've seen, you're looking at between three to $6,000 to get that bond annual premium paid upfront and that renews every year. And just like hopefully trucking insurance, if there's no filings on that bond after the first couple years, it'll go down. We've seen some renew as low as $1,000 for a brokerage as low as 500, I thought, for a brokerage that's been in business. But I think as we all know, with the insurance market in general and just brokerages, we were just talking about the numbers last week, but there has been a ton of brokerages and trucking companies that are exiting the market. And so there's been a lot of these bonds filed against. Tanner Batten : And so they are a little harder to get and they are more expensive than they used to be because insurance companies are losing their money on these bonds they're writing. Jared Flinn: So we can actually help set up the MCDOT number. Take that. We can take care of that. And then we also have the markets to get your surety bond, right? Tanner Batten : Yep. We can get you all that. Yeah. And then a BoC three, that that's required as well. We, we can handle that, but just like for the trucking company, it's just a designation of process agents in each state. Okay, cool. And so from there, those are, those are the requirements. You don't have to get plates? Not IFTA. Tanner Batten : It is simpler. You're looking at three to four weeks on the timeline. Then from there, once everything goes active, there's something we recommend called contingency coverage. And so it's not required by everyone but most legit shippers. Jared Flinn: We did it when I worked at Barlett because there were some that didn't have it and we would not hire them unless they had it. Tanner Batten : So it's not required by the FMCSA, but, uh, we recommend it that most shippers, you know, I've heard it. Uh, I was talking to a carrier last week about starting up a brokerage, and he said a large shipper, we wanted to secure a contract, said we need a contingency coverage because that lets us know you're legit. You, uh, you, you want to play, play ball. You mean business? And really what it is, is it's additional, you know, liability coverage, cargo coverage, auto and general liability for if at any point, you know, the carrier who is taking that loads, you know, insurance wouldn't cover it, that it doesn't come back on the shipper. Tyler Allison: Yep. Tanner Batten : So if you broker that load to that carrier, something happens. They exhaust their limits of insurance. The shipper wants to make sure there's no way it comes back on them. And you want to make sure it doesn't come back on you personally. Jared Flinn: Just a story. I can remember when I worked at a big grain company, shipping company, there was actually a number of brokers that didn't have that. And they would, it almost got heated because they would tell me, like, well, no, here is the trucker that's hauling it. Here's a certificate of insurance. Like, he is covered. Tanner Batten : Yeah. Jared Flinn: And, but our, through our corporate, our x, our credit manager, we would not accept it. That's like they had to have contingent. Usually it was contingent cargo. I thought maybe it's liability, too, but it was contingent cargo. But it was basically, if that carrier failed, then the brokers insurance would kick in. Tanner Batten : Yes, yes. And so it makes sense, especially for any larger company, they don't want to take on that risk. And so it definitely makes sense from that standpoint. One other thing I want to bring up is a lot of people have asked me, why not add a brokerage to my existing carrier authority? You can apply for that in the FMCSA say carrier slash broker, you know, if you have done that, I'm not saying it's wrong by any means, but sometimes what can happen, the reason you usually want it as a separate entity is your existing insurance company may see you added a brokerage and they may say that increases our risk and they no longer want to write your insurance for your trucking company because it's dispersing out those loads, things like that, and it can increase their liability. So that's usually why we recommend the separate entity. And again, we're not hiding anything, anything like that. But if it's right there on the same dot page, you know, on safer and it's added your authority, some insurance companies don't want to write that or take on that risk. Jared Flinn: Interesting. Cool. Tanner Batten : Always something new to learn. Jared Flinn: Yeah. Any other steps? Tanner Batten : That's, those are really the steps. It is much simpler than the trucking side. You know, like I said, the surety bonds probably, you know, between three and 6000, contingency coverage could be, you know, five to 10,000, maybe a little less than that. So that gives you a ballpark of the cost taking about a month, you know, so it's not as complicated, there's not as many steps as a trucking company, which maybe we could all agree there. Maybe there should be some more roadblocks. Jared Flinn: Yeah, I think I, yeah, the other thing I was going to add, it seems like there's a trend now where some of these companies, they usually, you know, they get the brokerage authority, they run all the freight through the brokerage and then that brokerage actually brokers that to the trucking company. Tanner Batten : Yes. Jared Flinn: So it's kind of like, I mean it's all kind of the same in a way, but like in order to do it the way it's supposed to be done, professionally and compliant and making sure everything's legal that, so basically that brokerage, whatever it is, whatever the name is, they're actually taking all that, all those loads. And then some go to the assets of the trucking company and then the others are actually brokered out to other carriers. Tyler Allison: Yeah. Tanner Batten : And usually after we get things set up, one of the next questions is how am I going to stay organized in this? How am I going to actually dispatch and do all that? Jared Flinn: Well, and. Yeah, that's what I was going to say too. And I want you to add, but yeah, make sure you keep everything separate like the dot wants to separate. Yeah. So you want a separate checking account. I mean you want all your separate probably quickbooks all your accounting. So it's because you're running two businesses here. This isn't absolutely, this isn't just another authority that's all kind of lumped together, because, again, if something were to happen, heaven forbid, you want to make sure that you got records, that it's all separated. Tanner Batten : Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And I think, yeah, that goes back to same thing. Why you may not just added in the same safer run two businesses, keep things separate. I know it may seem like a lot to keep track of, but it's the best way to do things. And like I was saying, the next most common question after we get things set up is how do I actually do this? How do I dispatch? How do I stay organized? Because it can be a lot to take on. And so, of course, maybe a little plug, but if you don't have some type of system in place, some type of TMS transportation management system, some type of dispatching and invoicing system, before you do this, that need is going to become all the greater. You talk about staying organized and keeping everything straight and what's going where. Tanner Batten : I think it'd be very, very, very difficult to do without a system. Yep. Jared Flinn: And a great system would be bulk loads. Tanner Batten : TMS. Jared Flinn: Bulk TMS, yeah, absolutely. So, yeah. And I think that's it's. It's set up, and we have companies right now that have the trucking and the, and the brokerage that they're running through TMS. And, man, it's working like a well greased machine. Tanner Batten : Yes, yes. And again, you know, we talked about the heart behind it. The heart behind it is serving our customers. And so we try to have products that fit the needs that they're going to need anyways. And we are very, like Jared said, too, it's not about even what we bring in. Like, we want it to be a good value for our customer and serve them well. And so that's. I mean, that's really the heart behind all of it. Tanner Batten : And so, yes, many of those companies who've set up brokerages this year, they're also set up on our TMS system so they can dispatch smoothly from the brokerage to their trucks and then other trucks as well. And that can all be done through the bulk loads app. Right. Those other drivers, your drivers, they get those loads dispatched through the bulk loads app, the TMS. Jared Flinn: Perfect. Well, man, this was a lot, but I think this is super cool. Again, I know that this isn't for everyone, but we do know that it is an option for companies out there that are maybe in that, maybe they're in that stage of like, hey, I have customers that want me to take more loads. I can't at this time, man. Interest rates are high. I can't buy other trucks. But I have other friends or coworker or whatever that can actually help me with this. How do I do this in a legal way? We want you to be legal and compliant out there. Jared Flinn: That is the main reason. Trying to step on the toes of other brokers or anything out there. But, man, we really want to make sure that we're doing everything we can to make our members successful as possible. So I'm excited about this. I think we see more and more of it today, and it's really just the way between, you know, regulations and, and how things are set up is it seems like this is a good opportunity and the best way for a lot of these companies to grow. Tanner Batten : Yep. Absolutely. No. Couldn't have said it better myself. And I know getting into the weeds can be a little dry at times, but we just, we've received a lot of questions of, okay, that sounds great, but what do I actually need to do? So hopefully today gave a good overview of the process, what's involved, and the costs. So you can kind of weigh that and see, you know, would this be a good opportunity for my business? And I think if it's done right, you can recoup those costs in no time at all. Jared Flinn: Awesome. Well, the plan of action to end here is to, if you have or, excuse me, if you're interested or just have questions, reach out to Tanner. If you drop down in the comments below, all the tanner's information is going to be in there, his email address, his direct phone number. But, yeah, please reach out to him. I think, man, you will be pleasantly surprised that I'll just say this, man, you're so friendly and you make you dumb things down to where it's just easy to understand. I think that's where, man, God's gifted you to be in this role and help these small trucking companies. So, again, reach out to Tanner if you have questions. If you would want to learn just a little bit more, is your, your talk time and all that is free of charge. Jared Flinn: So we want to help out. Tanner Batten : Don't be shy and, yeah, don't be afraid to ask questions. And it's. It's why I do what I do. Serving people, helping people, that's the end goal. And so, yeah, I'm thankful to. Thankful to be here. And then we get to serve our customers every day. Tyler Allison: Awesome. Jared Flinn: Tanner, thanks for coming on. Tanner Batten : Thanks, Jared. Tyler Allison: Well, Nick, what'd you think of the episode? Nic Matheney: God bless Tanner for dealing with permitting. In my experience, the working with the government, filling out that paperwork, that is an excruciating and mind numbing experience. And I would strongly urge our users to use Tanner instead of do it themselves. Myself, I would use Tanner, and he's a good friend, and he'll point you in the right direction. Tyler Allison: Yeah, I mean, the dude's just a wealth of knowledge, and I'm glad he's the one that's leading the permitting entity up, but, yeah, like you said, I mean, dealing with the government, I don't, I don't wish that upon anybody. If you have to, I'm sorry. If you can and want to outsource it to us, we'd be glad, Tanner would be even glad to just talk you through it. If you want to do it yourself but you're not sure how to go about it, give Tanner a call. He will walk you through. Even if you don't want us to do the full thing, maybe we can do, you know, take half the load off or whatever, just a reminder. We also do if does and stuff like that. But, yeah, Tanner's just, I mean, he's just, he's so knowledgeable. Tyler Allison: Like, it blows my mind how much he knows about this space now. Nic Matheney: He, he comes into our office every once in a while, Tyler. And if you guys have this experience, if you do your stuff yourself, please give us a call, because we like a good laugh every once in a while, listening to the responses from, from some of the dots and stuff like that about the rules and how sometimes I don't even know the right direction to point you. Tyler Allison: Yeah. Yeah. It's all mind blowing, honestly. Yeah. Good episode by Tanner. Tanner, we thank you for coming on. I'm sure we're going to have Tanner on in future episodes to keep going down this path of just educating everybody out there on the permitting side of things. I know he even talked about, you know, steps to starting your own brokerage. Tyler Allison: I want to remind everybody we're not just wanting a ton of brokers to get in this space and we're wanting to just set up everybody as a broker. The goal, the reason that we're doing it, is that we understand some carriers grow over the years and they get to the point where having a brokerage can actually help their business thrive. And that's what we want. And we don't want just brokers getting into the game, not knowing what they're doing. We'd rather them come to us, make sure they are educated, knowing what they're getting into, and maybe we can kind of help them along. And that way if they're getting into the bulk business, they kind of know what they're doing a little bit better. Nic Matheney: And from what I've seen talking to you guys on load board and stuff, the best brokers, especially in the bulk space, are people that have hauled the commodities, been to these places. They know what you need to unload. They're not going to hire somebody with no vibrators for ddgs in the middle of summer after it's rained or something like that. Tyler Allison: Yeah, that's a really good point, is I think me myself, I would rather, I think if I was a carrier, I would rather work with a broker who was a carrier himself or has skin in the game, I guess if you say absolutely. But yeah, great episode. Real quick, on the last episode that we did, we actually did a Carhartt giveaway. We asked if you were listening and you're wanting to participate. We asked to comment, I want a Carhartt. We got some bulk Litz Carhartt t shirts made up and they are slick. I snagged one myself. I really like the Carhartt four shirts. Tyler Allison: Jared's a big fan of them. But we picked two winners on the last episode. So the first one, and all I have is their username here. So their YouTube handle, Carlos r. 27 64 and Travis Howard, 542. You guys one are winners of the t shirt giveaway. So we will reach out to you, message you, and we will send you one completely free charge. I think on this one we're actually going to give away a Carhartt backpack. Tyler Allison: A Carhartt bulkless backpack. I think everybody in the office carries some around, but I noticed some guys, whenever they're driving a truck, they like to have them because they can throw, you know, clothes in them or snacks or, you know, whatever they need to and just packing the truck with them. So we're going to give away a Carhartt backpack on this episode. All you have to do is drop down in the comments. You will have to go over to YouTube, drop down in the comments and just simply say, I want a Carhartt backpack. And then you will be interested. We'll pick, pick a winner and we'll send it completely for free to you. One thing I want to cover before we jump out here is we have started doing a quick market update. Tyler Allison: And our first one, actually, while we're recording this went out this morning and basically, it's just a snapshot of what the market is doing. And the whole goal is to inform our users. That way they can make better business decisions on what they're seeing in the market and what they can kind of prepare for. Nick, you actually helped craft this together. So is there anything that you want to kind of touch on what you've been seeing? Yeah. Nic Matheney: So everything I've been seeing, with all the information we have, rates are staying about the same. But in today's climate and with elections coming up and everything, prices have gone outrageous. Shippers and brokers are holding on to their money as long as they can. So if you can use a factoring company, even work out in your broker agreement to get paid a little bit quicker, I would do so. Money in your bank account is power. Don't let other people hold your money when you can put it to use for your own company. Tyler Allison: Good point. Yeah. I mean, speaking on costs, like the cost of parts and maintenance is just through the roof. Fuel, I mean, has trickled down barely, but it's still, I mean, it's still high. Nic Matheney: We talk about it here at work. You know, bringing your lunch to work is something you can't do in the truck, and that's a huge expense. Eating out or keeping a refrigerator running in the truck and keeping fuel on that kind of stuff. I mean, groceries have even doubled, so, you know, that's something to think about when you're taking loads. Tyler Allison: Yeah, that's all a good point. And that's why I think what we really see whenever we talk to these guys, carriers, owner operators especially, is that's what, that's where the frustration draws from. You know, they see all these costs rising and rates don't rise by that much or they're staying the same or have even gone down in the past year. And that's where you always see the frustration at the, at the brokers, who, you know, who they say they don't have skin in the game. You know, we've seen many people say, you know, they only have a cell phone or whatever. Well, I think, you know, the purpose, hopefully, of doing these episodes is to educate everybody. And I think I'm a strong believer. And the more you know about your, um, your competition and even who you're dealing with, if I was a carrier, I would want to know as much as I could how a broker operates, what they got going on. Tyler Allison: Same thing with shipper. Um, just because the more knowledge you have, the more informed, the better decisions that you can make within your business. Nic Matheney: Yeah, and another thing is just having a good relationship. We speak on that all the time. But saying, hi, how are you? Or before you get into the business means a lot, especially to me and to everyone I know. Tyler Allison: Yeah, good point, good point. Well, I think that's pretty much it as far as the updates go. If you would like to receive this quick market update and you have not, for whatever reason, definitely just email us podcast olklets, we'll get you on the list. And it just covers all the bulk freight market and we want this to be a tool for you to use to make better business decisions. As said before, last but not least, guys, you know that we strongly believe in prayer here. We know that there's a lot of power in prayer. And just with the, all the natural disasters and the costs and everything, people having financial issues, some businesses struggling to survive out there, we really want to pray as much as we can during this time and just tug on God's sleeve and lift everybody up out there. So if you have any prayer requests, we'd ask that you just be so bold enough to email us prayer oakloads.com. Tyler Allison: those come in. You know, we don't share with anybody outside the company. We actually just pass them around to everybody inside the company. We have a prayer list and we go over every week. So. So with that being said, I'll go ahead and close out in prayer. Lord, we come to you today, just thank you and praise you. Lord, we ask that you just bless all of our members. Tyler Allison: Lord, we know that everything we have does not come from any of the work that we do, Lord, but you provide it for us. Lord, we ask that you just watch over everybody traveling this week, Lord. And we ask that every single one of our members in the transportation community, in the agriculture community, anybody watching this, Lord, I ask that you just bring them peace and give them strength to continue on with the issues that they're battling, whether it be financial burden, lord, relationship problems or just any natural disasters or anything out of their control. Lord, I ask that you just give them courage and peace to continue to go through the struggle. Lord, I ask that you just have them look upon you, Lord, you soften their hearts, Lord, and you just continue to bless them. Lord, I ask that whatever it might be, Lord, whoever we deal with, Lord, I ask that no matter what it is, whenever we're interacting with them, Lord, there's no doubt in their mind that we serve you, Lord, and that you are the ultimate God. Lord, we love you and we thank you. Amen. Tyler Allison: As always, before we close out this episode, if you know anybody who could benefit from this episode, we ask that you just simply copy the link and send it to them. This is the reason that we do these podcasts. You know, we don't get much from them, but our whole goal is to educate you, give you the power, our listeners give you the power. So we ask that you just share these episodes and you also subscribe to our podcast. So if you could. I think it's going to be in the left hand corner. If you could just go click on that and subscribe. So thank you. Tyler Allison: God blessed. I.